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How does that help get us closer to our Constitutional rights again? The Fourth Amendment (with its strong emphasis on the right of a person to be secure in their own home i.e. property) is contradictory to the idea of communal ownership of all property.

As far as ownership of business property, you could form a co-op or other employee-owned company structure today if you wished.... but the government won't force you to structure your business that way, either.



I don't know what kind of communism the OP refers to, but some kinds of communism defend the idea of personal property but are against private property.

Although I agree: How does joining a Communist or Anarchist group help? We need a broader movement. This isn't even a leftist thing (or only leftist).


All communists recognize personal property. Remember, communism is about communal ownership of the _means of production_, which is what 'private property' refers to. Nobody wants to share your toothbrush.


In some Communist states you didn't own your home or even your car.

To be fair, many Communists don't consider those states real communism. This is analogous to Libertarians rejecting state-run crony capitalism.


As soon as you permit property ownership you introduce a whole slate of ills with nary an end though.

Even personal property alone leads to greed and envy, which lead to suffering and eventually violence. Communism is not magic in this regard, nor is it the proper solution. There will always be a bully out to take your lunch money, at least with capitalism and representative democracy we're able to acknowledge that and try to rein in that aspect of human nature.


>at least with capitalism and representative democracy we're able to acknowledge that and try to rein in that aspect of human nature.

Citation needed. You'd need to find a group who lived completely outside of capitalism their entire lives and yet still exhibit these bad behaviors. And as it happens, lots of such examples exist. They don't bolster your assertion though.


You can't prove a negative, and nor can I. As you say, there are lots of examples of people who tried to setup economic systems outside of capitalism and still failed to keep humans from acting like humans, so I'd wager to say that the totality of evidence has definitely bolstered that particular assertion.


http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/articles/2009/12/06/...

This group lived outside of governance for 2 millennia and don't seem to have what you call "human nature". The fact is, our nature is partially "human nature" and partially a product of our environment. No one knows how much those two things contribute so you can't say "X is human nature". We don't really know and it's not easy to test. But capitalism doesn't exist everywhere and doesn't spontaneously pop up everywhere. What is true, however, is that capitalism seems to rely on continuous growth so they eventually encroach on non-capitalists and "convert" them.




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